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davidlwilliams
Massachusetts
47 Posts |
 Posted - 04/23/2014 : 07:29:59 AM
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If the line said "notary" then, in my opinion, your signature was the notarization. Having said this, Vermont where I do most of my business does not require a stamp. If you are in a stamp required state or one that requires specific wording with your expiration date, than it was not notarized. If it required either a stamp or specific wording, I have to wonder why it was not worded in such a way. Depending on the document, I would probably just signed it as witness.
Just my thoughts. |
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LindaH
Florida
1754 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2011 : 06:12:31 AM
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quote:
Originally posted by lkassis
Hi Gang, I need your opinion. Don't know what I could be missing to make these people so outraged that I wouldn't comply.
Did seller docs to a purchase. There was a short sale letter indicating signature of husband and wife. Off to the right there was a spot indicating "notary" with an x. I signed thinking: ok, they must just want a witness to the signature but not a notarization. This was not formatted in a way that would make one question if they were really wanting a notarization completed. I signed the notary spot.
A few days later they send me an acknowledgment and ask me to complete it and return it to them. I said I couldn't do it after the fact. If they wanted it acknowledged I would need to meet with the sellers and complete it for the date I met with them. In Iowa, an ack does not need to be signed in front of the notary, the signer simply needs to ack it is their signature so I gave two options: 1) new doc, new signatures, and ack dated the day they sign the new doc; or 2) originally signed document and once I met with signer I could ack for date that I complete the ack.
These signers came to the Iowa portion of the city to meet with me originally (they live in Nebraska part of the city of which I am not a notary).
Do you think I should have complied with their request to complete an acknowledgment and send it to them after the fact?
Linda Kassis
United Notary Association (UNAA)
www.unitednotaries.org
www.halitek.com
If you are not riding the wave of change, you may find yourself under it. Ride the wave with the UNAA.
If the signature line just had "notary" printed under it, then I would have taken that to mean notarization required - I'd check with hiring party as to which they wanted, ack or jurat (although I know the answer it's not my call) then I would have added FL compliant notary wording and signed and stamped or I'd have attached a FL compliant cert - absent proper wording I can't sign and stamp as a notary as there's no notarial act.
And I have to agree with your procedure - in FL we can't add certs or change certs after the fact - it would require a revisit with the signers and a cert dated the date of the revisit.
As for why they're outraged? They're outraged because you won't be a sheeple and do what you're told!! Even though it was your error and you, no doubt, will go out and fix it on your dime, they want it dated the original date, not the current date.
No, you should NOT comply with their request - your duty is to comply with your state notary laws.
JMO
Linda
www.notarydepot.com/notary/lindah
http://www.notary.net/websites/LindaHubbell |
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lkassis
Iowa
60 Posts |
Posted - 07/20/2011 : 06:09:59 AM
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The document formatting was as follows (bottom of doc):
____________________________________________________________________
By signing below, I hereby acknowledge and agree to the terms stated in the above letter agreement and understand that after short sale proceeds are applied to my loan balance that the status of my loan will be reported to the credit bureaus as "Paid in Full for less than the full balance".
_____________________________________________________________________
___________________ __________________ ___________________
(Borrower) Date Notary
___________________ ___________________
(Co-Borrower) Date
Lender is required by law to inform you that this communication is from a debt collector. However, the purpose of this communication is to let you know about your potential eligibility for this program to help you avoid foreclosure.
**************
So as you can see, the placement of the indicated notary signature, imo, did not indicate they wished for the document to be notarized. There are times I have seen an indication for a signature (usually stating closing agent) in which it is meant for the Notary Signing Agent to sign.
Linda Kassis
United Notary Association (UNAA)
www.unitednotaries.org
www.halitek.com
If you are not riding the wave of change, you may find yourself under it. Ride the wave with the UNAA. |
Edited by - lkassis on 07/20/2011 06:12:15 AM |
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Notary007
60 Posts |
Posted - 07/19/2011 : 11:23:46 PM
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If the spot was labeled notary, then you signed in your notary capacity, not as a witness. If you signed as a notary, then you need to complete a notarial certificate. The certificate is missing. You cannot sign a notary "autograph", (although I have read that some famous Hollywood stars were once notaries).
Since you should not choose the type of certificate to attach, I think you should have asked the signers or the doc preparer what type of certificate they wanted, and then attached it and notarized it.
To add the ack now, you could follow your option 1 or 2, as long as you use the date of notarization, not the prior meeting date.
Asking you to complete a loose ack is probably an illegal request and could lead to fraud if they attach it to another doc. Since you gave an autograph, not a notarization, at the original meeting, completing a loose ack and backdating it would be false. The ack must be attached to the doc, not loose.
Check your state notary laws and handbook. If you find the law regarding completing a loose certificate, you can show it to the requestor. If they sent the request to you in writing, you have written evidence that they were attempting to influence you.
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lkassis
Iowa
60 Posts |
Posted - 07/19/2011 : 6:36:33 PM
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Hi Gang, I need your opinion. Don't know what I could be missing to make these people so outraged that I wouldn't comply.
Did seller docs to a purchase. There was a short sale letter indicating signature of husband and wife. Off to the right there was a spot indicating "notary" with an x. I signed thinking: ok, they must just want a witness to the signature but not a notarization. This was not formatted in a way that would make one question if they were really wanting a notarization completed. I signed the notary spot.
A few days later they send me an acknowledgment and ask me to complete it and return it to them. I said I couldn't do it after the fact. If they wanted it acknowledged I would need to meet with the sellers and complete it for the date I met with them. In Iowa, an ack does not need to be signed in front of the notary, the signer simply needs to ack it is their signature so I gave two options: 1) new doc, new signatures, and ack dated the day they sign the new doc; or 2) originally signed document and once I met with signer I could ack for date that I complete the ack.
These signers came to the Iowa portion of the city to meet with me originally (they live in Nebraska part of the city of which I am not a notary).
Do you think I should have complied with their request to complete an acknowledgment and send it to them after the fact?
Linda Kassis
United Notary Association (UNAA)
www.unitednotaries.org
www.halitek.com
If you are not riding the wave of change, you may find yourself under it. Ride the wave with the UNAA. |
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need opinion-add ack after the fact
