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edelske
New York
815 Posts |
 Posted - 12/09/2009 : 8:27:11 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Notarykat
The "owner" of the finance company screamed at me that it was her decision to let the wife sign the docs in her husband's name. That I could allow this. I told her I could not allow that since there was no power of attorney.
The "owner" is well within their "right" to grant permission for the wife to sign the docs for the husband. It's their docs and they can allow them to be signed any way they see fit.
HOWEVER
It's YOUR decision to use or not use YOUR signature, stamp and seal. I see no problem here. They are allowing what you (rightfully) deem an UN-Notarizeable signature. Let them. You just don't notarize it.
They control their domain of authority (the docs)- you control yours - (the notarization process). As it's obvious you have no notary work to do - it's time to just go home.
Kenneth A Edelstein
Mobile Notary, Apostille / Legalization Processing & Fingerprinting
http://www.kenneth-a-edelstein.com |
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Notarykat
North Carolina
25 Posts |
Posted - 11/10/2009 : 07:03:12 AM
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The National Notary Associations "Notary Bulletin" has written an article about the Loan Modification Companies that collect up-front fees to modify mortgage loans.
Below is the link to view the list of California Loan Modification Companies that have been sent cease and desist orders from the CA Attorney General's office.
The company that targeted me is not on the list but I am glad this issue is being taken seriously enough to notify "notaries" to beware.
NotaryKat
http://www.dre.ca.gov/cons_drs.asp
Notarykat |
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n/a
Florida
1 Posts |
Posted - 10/23/2009 : 5:41:41 PM
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By Florida Law, you are correct. You must have the information available to you when you make the appointment. In fact, I have always been instructed to remind the client that they must have the checks ready. It will be clear on the documents that you receive if you have to collect a check. Because you can't advise the client anything about the loan documents, if it states that you must collect a check then you will be covered legally. In addition, you were so right to refuse to allow the wife to sign for the husband without a power of attorney. I have been a notary since 1984, but a NSA since 2009, so I am basically in training, that said, I can tell you that I not only follow the letter of the law (Notary law primer) (Governers Notary Laws), but my instinct. I have had a few situations that did not feel right, and while I did not go through what you did, it was headed in that direction. Keep your confidence.
I HAVE THIS ON MY E-MAIL SIGNATURE PAGE, I THINK IT HELPS KEEP THINGS IN PERSPECTIVE.
I am not an attorney and therefore, by law, I cannot explain or
interpret the contents of any documents for you,instruct you
on how to complete a document or direct you on the advisability
of signing a particular document. By doing so I would be engaging in the unauthorized practice of law, and could face legal penalties
that include the possibility of incarceration. Any important questions about your document should be addressed to the lender,title company or an attorney.
THIS IS MY PLEDGE OF ETHICAL PRACTICE
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LindaH
Florida
1754 Posts |
Posted - 10/23/2009 : 11:30:15 AM
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"Lastly, it is my opinion that you might avoid the phrase, “it is illegal to...” That sounds like a legal opinion rather than a personal opinion to me"
I disagree with this - you don't need to be a lawyer to be aware of what's legal and illegal in your state. All lay people know it's illegal to steal and telling someone so isn't a legal opinion - it's fact.
I know, for a fact, that taking upfront fees for mortgage modification applications is illegal in my state - and I have no problem telling any company calling me and asking me to do it that what they're asking is illegal here. It's not my legal opinion - it's the legal opinion of our legislature and our Attorney General...
MHO
Linda
www.notarydepot.com/notary/lindah
http://www.notary.net/websites/LindaHubbell
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tomthenotary
Maryland
82 Posts |
Posted - 10/22/2009 : 9:50:33 PM
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I wouldn't even ask them to lower the tone, I would have hung up while they were screaming, who needs that! Alot desperate people out there who think they are getting help and others helping themselves on the backs of the needy. Bad part, its only going to get worst as folks struggle to make ends meet.  |
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vince
Kansas
324 Posts |
Posted - 10/22/2009 : 4:55:30 PM
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quote:
Originally posted by Notarykat
I had a signing yesterday and I was told by the signing company and the finance company that the borrowers were in two different locations. I actually discovered this when I called to confirm the appointment and had to tell them. They told me they would be sending docs to the husband at his location to sign. The wife would be signing with me. I got to the house and the wife insisted I let her sign her husband's name. I told her she did not have a power of attorney and I could not let her do that. She called the finance company and handed me the phone. The "owner" of the finance company screamed at me that it was her decision to let the wife sign the docs in her husband's name. That I could allow this. I told her I could not allow that since there was no power of attorney. After listing to this woman scream at me on the phone...a professional mind you... or at least she was trying to pass herself off as one. I left. The other problem here was that the woman was going to give me a check for a loan modification application. In the State of North Carolina it is illegal to charge an upfront fee for loan modifications. I am not a lawyer and I never gave the borrower any advice but the signing company said I did. They called me up and asked what happened. I told them exactly what happened and then they said I was a liar. They accused me of screaming at the finance owner... a lie, they accused me of being a bad notary...a lie. Then they said they stick up for their notaries. Ha! I got an email this morning and they told me they had someone else go out to have the woman sign the docs. I reported this issue to the AG's office. I was asked by the signing company if I knew it was illegal before I went out there? Ah duh, no one told me I would collect any money. Then they said they thought maybe it was legal because the finance company was affiliated with a law office. I don't know but again I didn't go to law school and on first blush this looked illegal when the check appeared in the borrower's hand. I wish they would stop trying to wreck my as a notary.
Notarykat
It's really too bad you were not aware up front what this signing was for. A lesson learned, as you'll know to ask in the future if this is a loan modification, and if so, if a check will be required up front. First you'll need to decide if you'll do these kinds of assignments (I am like many and do not). You should also know the company's payment policy if you have a cancellation, if they do not sign, if they rescind and so on.
You should contact the company that is paying you before leaving an assignment whenever possible. If someone is yelling at you, sure, excuse yourself and call whoever hired you before deciding to leave or actually driving away. Better they get your story before someone else makes something up and you'll know where you stand that much sooner. Further, the company will talk with you while it is still fresh in your mind.
Lastly, it is my opinion that you might avoid the phrase, “it is illegal to...” That sounds like a legal opinion rather than a personal opinion to me (I'm not a lawyer either). Let us know what you hear, if anything more on this one.
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Lisa T.
California
391 Posts |
Posted - 10/22/2009 : 12:18:17 PM
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<<<After listing to this woman scream at me on the phone...a professional mind you...>>>
No way would I listen to someone scream at me [on the phone or in person]....I'd immediately tell him/her, "Lower your tone or I will hang up on you" and the next sound they'd hear is CLICK, if they didn't lower their tone on the phone...If it's in person, I'd walk out on them.
No one screams at me....I am not a child, and if I were a child, I am not their child. |
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Lee-AR
Arkansas
678 Posts |
Posted - 10/22/2009 : 10:11:05 AM
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Well, I do see one possible problem here... don't think these loan mod applications need notarization. So she could sign Donald Duck and you really wouldn't care.
I'd have probably just told the lady to do whatever she wanted and mail it to them--and uninvolve myself right then.
Gotta say, tho', that as more notaries refuse to do these, the loan mod appl. companies are getting sneakier by the day. They sent you out 'blind' to what it was. That sucks big time.
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Notarykat
North Carolina
25 Posts |
Posted - 10/22/2009 : 07:48:51 AM
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I had a signing yesterday and I was told by the signing company and the finance company that the borrowers were in two different locations. I actually discovered this when I called to confirm the appointment and had to tell them. They told me they would be sending docs to the husband at his location to sign. The wife would be signing with me. I got to the house and the wife insisted I let her sign her husband's name. I told her she did not have a power of attorney and I could not let her do that. She called the finance company and handed me the phone. The "owner" of the finance company screamed at me that it was her decision to let the wife sign the docs in her husband's name. That I could allow this. I told her I could not allow that since there was no power of attorney. After listing to this woman scream at me on the phone...a professional mind you... or at least she was trying to pass herself off as one. I left. The other problem here was that the woman was going to give me a check for a loan modification application. In the State of North Carolina it is illegal to charge an upfront fee for loan modifications. I am not a lawyer and I never gave the borrower any advice but the signing company said I did. They called me up and asked what happened. I told them exactly what happened and then they said I was a liar. They accused me of screaming at the finance owner... a lie, they accused me of being a bad notary...a lie. Then they said they stick up for their notaries. Ha! I got an email this morning and they told me they had someone else go out to have the woman sign the docs. I reported this issue to the AG's office. I was asked by the signing company if I knew it was illegal before I went out there? Ah duh, no one told me I would collect any money. Then they said they thought maybe it was legal because the finance company was affiliated with a law office. I don't know but again I didn't go to law school and on first blush this looked illegal when the check appeared in the borrower's hand. I wish they would stop trying to wreck my as a notary.
Notarykat |
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I can't do that it's illegal
